Ep 272: Eggs & Issues 2026 Pt. 2 - Policymakers on Education Funding

On this special episode we’re taking a look at the Public School Forum’s annual Eggs & Issues event, which was held on April 7 in Raleigh this year. Eggs & Issues is held at the beginning of each legislative session so that the Forum can share our policy agenda for the biennium. This year’s program featured a panel of policymakers from the North Carolina General Assembly discussing revenue and school funding – a critical conversation considering North Carolina is now the only state in the nation without a current budget.

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:13

Welcome to Education Matters, presented by the Public School Forum of North Carolina. I'm your host for the week, Shantae Russell. In this special edition episode, we'll be taking a look at the public school forum's annual eggs and issues event, which was held on April 7th in Raleigh this year. This year's program featured a panel of policymakers from the North Carolina General Assembly discussing revenue and school funding, a critical conversation considering that North Carolina is now the only state in the nation without a current budget. Thank you for tuning in, and hopefully you'll learn something new and share with you learn within your community.

SPEAKER_01 0:44

Um as we get ready for this panel, and and we'll call it uh something different than revenue spending and policy priorities, let's just call this the Venmo panel. Because like our previous presenters, I don't think anybody in this room minds how you get the money cash check, Venmo, whatever it is. We know that that the financial ties back to how we do what we do in this state are important. Uh the North Carolina General Assembly has a job to do in allocating those funds. We all know in this space you need champions of the work to be able to advance these initiatives forward. And we are proudly going to hear today from four folks that are going to be very involved in that conversation as the short slash long slash short session begins here in the very near future. Uh but but also it's it's important too to put some faces with this work because these are people trying to do the work too. And we are thankful for their willingness to come here this morning and talk about these issues, but also the willingness of all of our legislators to to answer the phone when we call uh and and have uh these conversations turn into hopefully policy that that will make everything work. I'll be calling on uh specific legislators for these questions, but all of you feel free to chime in if you've got something to share here just to keep us moving along. Representative Biggs, we're gonna go back to something that you mentioned uh a moment ago in your introduction. You've got no shortage of priorities uh as you enter the short session with the budget still looming. What are some of those things that that you feel are the tough decisions, the trade-offs that you're going to have to consider as you get into this session?

SPEAKER_02 2:21

Well, we when we're going into the the budget negotiations, actually, you guys will be really happy to hear. I can tell you from the house side, teacher pay is one of our biggest priorities. That's one of the biggest priorities in caucus. That's one of our biggest priorities. Uh, and we want a meaningful raise, not a one or two percent. We want a meaningful raise. And I will tell you I am a chair of appropriations. I'm not the final say, but we want to make sure that we're paying you guys and making sure we're getting the best and the brightest, you know, making it where you can. I I'm a realtor, that's my day job. You know, we're part-time legislators, but sometime we're full-time, I guess. I think we're gonna be full-time, but uh coming up here soon. But, you know, I want to make sure that you guys, as a realtor, you know, teachers can buy houses, you know, do things, raise families, and that's a big priority we have. And and those things as far as trade-offs, you know, really when we're looking at things, education to me is not something that you can trade off, it's not something we can negotiate with, it's something we gotta have. You see the opportunities, we've heard the stories today, and the opportunities that people have because of education and because that people believed in them. So that's one of the things we try to be real stick with on the education, and teacher pay is one of my biggest priorities, if not my biggest priority.

SPEAKER_01 3:36

Leader Batch, I'll come to you uh with this same question, but also uh the time constraints of the available time that you have, also a consideration. How will you work um in terms of the Senate Democratic caucus, making sure that everything education-wise is done from an equitable standpoint and you've got the voice uh to be able to bring the minority's uh thoughts and issues to the table?

SPEAKER_05 4:00

Yeah, so I would say that you know, right Representative Biggs, our Senate caucus cares very deeply about teacher pay as well. And that's why many of us actually voted for the House budget, because the House budget did a lot more than what the Senate budget did, and you saw the um at least the quick uh slide earlier. The reality of the situation is we uh in the minority, but the Senate and in the House uh Democrats can we have a voice and that and we will use that voice. Um I am one of a few votes that we obviously have in the building, but what I can also tell you is that the Senate Republicans have not come, in my opinion, to the table in a genuous way to go ahead and try and address these needs. I hope now that primaries are over that we are actually able to move forward with regards to a budget. Regarding time constraints, it's short session, but you know what, we're still in long session. Uh we can just stay there as long as we need to in order to deliver a budget, but also the priorities for education here in North Carolina. And so I would love to just go back to my actual day job that pays my bills. Um, but the reality is that we were all elected to do this one job. Um, as Representative Biggs said, we all want teachers to have one job. Like we chose two jobs because we decided to run for office, but we didn't have to do that. I can make enough money on my one job. But I represent teachers in my law offices that have two or three jobs because they are not able to work the one job that they went to school for. And so when we're talking about priorities, we should care about the teachers that are in our classrooms every single day educating our children and educating our future, that's going to deliver the return on investment into our state for both being number one in corporations, but also in all of the areas that we need right now for all of the jobs that are coming in the future. So, with regards to at least our position, we will be loud. We will be very vocal. All of you, if those of you know me, that like I always say that you're gonna catch this mouth because I can't throw these hands. So we're gonna continue to be in a situation where we will be loud and we will talk about the things that are important, and we hope that at least at least six of our Senate colleagues will join us. I would love all 30 of my Senate Republican colleagues to join us and trying to pass a budget and work with the House on a budget that is that we can deliver for everyone. But if not, then they'll just continue to catch this mouth.

SPEAKER_01 6:21

Leader Batch, as as you understand as well as everybody in this room understands, property tax is part of the funding equation. What do you feel like the legislature's best move is to ensure that districts have what they need, given all of these revenue sources?

SPEAKER_05 6:37

So I think they need to stay out of local property tax business. I mean there has been an increased pattern of the legislature trampling on other, whether it's municipalities, whether it's the executive branch, heck the judicial branch as we see. Um that depend that opinion on Leandro, uh it's amazing that the majority walked away, and clearly logic and they were not walking together, if you read that opinion. I am a lawyer, so I understood it uh differently and read it. But at the end of the day, ultimately what they said is it's the legislature's job. It's not our job to deal with policy. Okay, well, then it's the legislature's job. If the legislature was told by the Supreme Court to do their job, then that's exactly what we need to do, which means to go ahead and ensure that we are providing a sound basic education that is constitutionally founded in our state statute, I mean in our in our state constitution for every single child, which also means that we actually have to pay for it. Again, we can't just decide to give more responsibilities to our school systems and then say, figure it out, you don't need to, you don't need more money.

SPEAKER_04 7:45

After the break, we'll hear more from the policymaker panel at Exit Issues 2026. Welcome back. Let's hop right back into our revenue and school funding panel at Exit Issues 2026.

SPEAKER_01 8:01

Representative Ryan and and Hawkins, I'll give this next question to you all. And and Representative Ryan, I'll start with you. You said something a moment ago in talking about how in your home district you were very intentional uh about how funding was was allocated and there was transparency to that process. Uh when you look at the Opportunity Scholarship Voucher Program as it expands, we saw a graph just a little while ago about where that spending will continue to go. How do you, as a legislator, ensure that there is transparency and accountability for how these funds are being utilized, especially as some of the public schools and districts are are dealing with funding cuts on their end?

SPEAKER_03 8:40

Yeah, thank you for the question. Uh first I'll say um let me squash the the rumor that there is zero accountability and opportunity scholarships, because there is a whole statute on that that you can look at where there is testing and there is um reporting requirements for schools that take students that have that have opportunity scholarships. But I do think it's important to continue to have that discussion and to look at um what that accountability looks like. I think those discussions are happening. I've heard I know I've heard just coming into the General Assembly, I know I've already heard colleagues having that discussion of kind of what does that look like. But overall, I'll say from an opportunity scholarship standpoint, it's the one really bipartisan, if you if you look at any polling out there, Republicans and Democrats, more than 60% support the opportunity scholarship program. And so it really is a bipartisan um effort to make sure that our our our kids are um getting the education that that in an environment that they feel like they will thrive in. Um when I look at the state budget in this big pot of money that we have, I think when you look at it as a whole instead of just this is education funding, this is healthcare funding, and and so on and so forth, when you look at that pot as a whole, you're really not looking at when opportunity scholarships are saying we're taking from here and moving it here. I think we're saying this money in the state is being invested in a child's education, and I think that's a very, very important to call out and to remember is that any money invested in a child's education is extremely important. But I'll say there are other areas that I serve in. Obviously, as a pharmacist, I serve in health care, and I think there are ways in our budget and things that we need to look at. We all want to look, it feels like public school always want to look at opportunity scholarships, but there are other areas in our budget that we've got to look at from a healthcare standpoint from fraud, waste, and abuse, and some things that we are really diving into where money is potentially being wasted, or um we we could use it more efficiently that will that will continue to help fund education. So I I'm excited about the opportunities that are there. I'm excited about the bipartisan effort that that we have in this.

SPEAKER_01 10:54

Representative Hawkins, how do you view the the balance between supporting families and also making sure that there's accountability for this program?

SPEAKER_00 11:02

I I think that you know public dollars belong with public schools, right? And um because the um as I say on on my floor speeches, uh you know, I do a lot of things that, you know, I buy things privately, and the state does not uh subsidize my car. It does not subsidize a lot of things that we do, and I've you know I see it the same way. If if you want to move towards a private education, you should want to pay for it. Um but uh I think what when we're looking at the long term, I think they're looking at about seven billion dollars spent by 2032 or something along those lines. And I remember when this started, I think Sydney, you were in the house, and I'm not sure if uh Representative Biggs had gotten there yet. Um, but it was uh we were spending about $25 million in opportunity scholarships, and it was based on um, you know, like people saying, hey, I want it. And I said, well, why is that why just continue that trend? Let people ask for it. And the next thing you know, um last session, or yeah, that that next session, we put it on steroids, $50 million a year, and it was almost to the point of $500 million over a decade. And for what? And you know, you know, and it just didn't seem like it was the right place for us to go when we were already seeing the challenges that public education was facing. Um he mentioned, you know, teacher pay, but uh we're talking about out-of-pocket spending from teachers. Like look at the stats of where we are and per people spending and teacher pay, like 43rd and 50th. Like that's just not who North Carolina is, and so um we sort of uh live by the golden rule, like keep the main thing the main thing. Like if if we have 1.5 million kids in our public school system, then that needs to be the thing that is funded first, and then we can get to uh what is uh what's next. And uh well a few of the things that you know for me around the voucher program, and I understand that there are some accountabilities, but um, you know, one thing before I get to to some of that is m most of these uh uh opportunity scholarships are coming to places like Charlotte, Raleigh, and Durham. They're not going to rural areas. And so, you know, what kind of we don't, you know, I'm not saying that we don't need additional choice, if we always do in those areas, but we want, you know, the part of it should be making sure that especially students who have less choice in some of those areas have it, and they don't. And the numbers really rule that out. It is really an urban underwriting of of education, and um, and that's something that's uh problematic and should be problematic for everybody. You know, uh also the teachers being certified and making sure that you know they have a curriculum that uh can stand the standard course of study across North Carolina. Like there should be, if you're using public dollars, we have to look at equity in the way that we apply the standards um for for private education. And you know, and so and then lastly for me, I think um when you think about this program and uh accountability and and the way you spend it, uh we have people who make a million dollars who can participate in this program. There are no income caps on the voucher program. And and that again is just not a good use of if somebody can pay for it, they should be able to pay for it. And and for those, and again, in the origins of the program for people who needed choice who could not afford it, like that's just been abandoned. And so uh I do think that it's a a great time given where we are with our state budget and our forecast, um, and the state of sort of education in North Carolina and the way it plays a role in workforce development, like it is worth opening the can again and seeing if we're doing it the right way. Um, because I'm like my colleagues, I want to make sure that um every dollar is used well, that it's directed towards student outcomes, because that again allows North Carolina to become this amazing state and continue to be number one in business, can be number one um in uh in workforce development, but be a place where when those companies come, every s every student can't go to a private school, but we have great public schools that they can send their kids to that can build a long-term sustainable program for us. And so I think all those things have to come into bear, and I'm glad to work with my colleagues to continue to have that discussion.

SPEAKER_01 15:19

We have one more uh big topic to get into before we we have our closing thoughts here. And and I do want to take a second and thank those few members of the business community that are in the room here today and challenge you all to bring friends next time. We need the business voice in this conversation uh about how we are seeing our next generation of business leaders come to us. The number of times from a chamber perspective we hear about what is deficient in today's workforce. A lot of it comes right back to this conversation about how we fund and set up our local public schools for success in bringing those people to us in the first place. And it's with that I think there's also a great parallel line in how we are dealing with the workforce in education moving forward. So, Representative Hawkins, I'll I'll ask you this first and we'll bring this to the entire panel here. You've had involvement in the drive task force, which addresses educator recruitment, diversity, and specific policy priorities that that you've championed uh within that work. What do you see as an opportunity in the short session to drive those points, no pun intended, of course, uh to drive those points home more uh about recruitment, retention, and workforce diversity as we make sure that there are enough educators and skilled educators to deliver the education that we're trying to provide.

SPEAKER_00 16:38

Well, thank thank you for that question. Um in North Carolina, 57 percent of students are of color, uh, but less than 30 percent of teachers are of color. It makes a difference in the classroom. Everybody benefits when we have a diver uh diverse teacher workforce. Um but some of the things actually we are working on in the House budget. I want to give Representative Biggs uh uh a couple shout out. Well, he'll hear this and and hear his shout-outs. Um, but he mentioned one already. Um proposed in the in the budget, um I think uh Representative Parray was the one to put this forward originally, was that we uh increase uh starting teacher pay at $54,000 a year, which will put us top in the Southeast and 10th nationally. Like that's that's a way to move forward. Uh the second the second piece is making sure that we um you know continue to support uh TA to teachers. Um every county that you can imagine has a TA who's been there for 10 or 15 years that we just need to support so they can go and get their bachelor's degree to become a full-time teacher. They will stay in those classrooms. That's something that helps uh with diversifying the teacher workforce, but it helps the entire workforce, especially in rural areas. Same with Grow Your Own. Um, and one thing that uh Represent Biggs helped with is uh expanding the Teaching Fellows program to more schools, especially HBCUs, uh, that we know have a long legacy of making sure that we put qualified teachers, administrators, um, and others in the classroom and the in the decision-making space. And so those are a few things that we've done that I know that we can get done if we move forward with the House budget. And so I think one thing that I want to make sure that people understand is that what is good for the recruitment, retention, um, and growth of teachers of color are good for all teachers, right? That is the important part to walk away with. Um and uh the benefits again uh play themselves out, and so this is one thing that you know, once we get through those three items that I mentioned, uh there are a host of others which we we've already talked about. Um, but I do think that uh this session we can get through those three because they've already been named in at least the House budget, and I think once or twice in the Senate budget.

SPEAKER_04 18:47

After the break, we'll hear our panelists wrap up this conversation with their priorities for the coming legislative session.

SPEAKER_01 19:00

Batch, I'll let you start us down the line here. Anything that you're going to be advocating for in the short session that that falls in line with these priorities?

SPEAKER_05 19:07

Yes, I think it's important. Um, we should talk about obviously starting pay, but we have educators that have dedicated their entire lives to students that we need to actually respect, honor, and make sure that we increase STEP funding. It isn't enough to get people in the door. It is a revolving door right now where teachers are leaving, right? So when you get to that step level and then you say, Oh, right, you've been here long enough, but we're not gonna get paid, who stays in a job in the private sector to say I'm not gonna get a raise for a decade? Nobody. There's no there that you'd be a dummy. Now, what I'm telling you as educators is that you care more about our students and about your career because you and many are actually leaving, because we are not respecting the educators who have dedicated their entire lives to be able to stay in the classroom and teach. And there are a lot of educators who are choosing to leave or to go into a different field or position and not stay in the classroom, right? But go into administration because they're just trying to figure out how to make ends meet. So if we just figured out a way where we could, I don't know, pay people for master's degrees again, and I don't know, respect them for the fact that they should always get a raise and not have to work on, frankly, all of our educators are now living on 2026 expenses but on a 2023 salary, that we can very easily equalize this. But it's a decision and a priority that the legislature has to make. And so I really do appreciate us talking about new teachers, but we have to go ahead and ensure that we are not investing so much money into our in into the system at the early age and stage where then we leave we lose teachers a decade later. We want people to stay in the field of education for their entire careers, but I completely understand why people are leaving.

SPEAKER_01 20:52

Representative Ryan, uh, your thoughts on on how to uh to continue to advocate for the educator pipeline.

SPEAKER_03 20:59

So I I'll tell you my top, I would say, three priorities kind of moving into short session are really budgetary items, teacher pay. I think everybody up here has mentioned that, of course. I think the House has been clear where we stand on that. Um but advanced teaching roles is another one, and expanding that across the state is extremely important. It also helps our teachers. I've seen the effect of that and what that can do in districts as far as outcomes. But then also you mentioned business leaders coming in. I think it's important. Um then short session to get the workforce act of 2026 done, which is really going to help our apprenticeship in C program, our North Carolina uh careers. It'll provide a digital transcript to make some seamless education pathways and some other things. And so I think that's going to be very important moving forward for children. Um the other thing is I'll say when it when it comes comes to coming into short session. This is something I've done, I think, since I entered the General Assembly. I was appointed at the end of 2024. And that is really coming in with a different sort of perspective and a different sort of attitude. And we all want to say, let's take politics out of it. And I think you've heard some people say that here this morning take the politics out then take the politics out is what I would say. Blame is the parking break for change is the parking break to change. And instead of me coming in and blaming or you coming in and blaming, we all have to sit here and take ownership. We have to all take ownership for something. We have to take ownership, you have to take ownership for what those outcomes look like for students for what we're doing in North Carolina. And I'll say having two daughters who went through public education and are absolutely thriving at NC State, you should be proud of what you're doing. And so I think really breaking through some of the noise has been my focus. There's a lot of noise up here. There's a lot of political noise and breaking through that noise getting in a room rolling up our sleeves and getting something done is what I will stay focused on.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Representative Biggs, your thoughts on the education pipeline?

SPEAKER_02 23:19

Well uh focus is uh Randolph County motto students first in all we do. That's our motto in Randolph County and when I was on the Board of Education there also. There is so much we're trying to look at right now. We're going to make sure we take care of our CTE programs. That's been mentioned many times up here. Obviously teacher pay is first priority if you listen to and it's it's all online if you listen to speaker of house speaker of the house Destin Hall his first speech was about paying teachers and about when he was on the floor and about what he wanted to do and the impact that teachers had in his life. And just so you know we're working now just because we're not in session we're working now I'll be in I was in the office last week I'll be in the office this week we're working now getting ready for this short long session. And guys if we're there December 31st that's fine. We're going to get it done and I appreciate you guys having us here today. Thank you. Thank you sir.

SPEAKER_04 24:09

Thank you for taking time to learn and think with us about education. That's all for today and we'll see you next week